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Re: 12th Ga never lost a flag - evidence
In Response To: Re: 12th Ga never lost a flag ()

Shawn and all,

Once again, the claim of the capture of the 102nd New York of the flag of the 12th Georgia (given capture #WD19) is false, and for several reasons as follows:

1) The veterans denied the loss of the flag and cited evidence from their division commander (Gen. Robert Rodes)who stated that three flags from his division were captured from his troops. His report states:

"Rode's Brigade - 5th Alabama lost its colors; Ramseur's Brigade - 2nd North Carolina lost its colors and the 4th North Carolina lost its colors; Inverson's Brigade - no flags lost; Doles' Brigade (of which the 12th Georgia was part) - no flags lost." (OR I, 24, Pt. 1 - Page 949)

If you read the accounts of this battle from Bigelow, the ORs and Sears' book, part of Doles' Brigade slammed into Geary's Division from almost their rear while the other part went to support an adjacent attack. Geary's rear guard, as his troops fell back, were the 60th and 102nd New York. Geary's line was bent into an angle with Anderson's CS Division hitting the other side from Doles' troops. The two NY regiments repulsed the Doles' attack and then the two regiments of that brigade side-slipped the Union line and moved onwards.

2) Col. Lane of the 102nd New York claims to have captured the 12th Georgia's color bearer. However, other evidence shows that the color bearer, Spencer Bears (Co. C), was only slightly wounded and not captured until Gettysburg. This is from his CSR files.

3) WD 367, in the Museum of the Confederacy, is identified to the 12th Georgia. It is half the flag and with some of its battle honors including "Fredericksburg." That means that this flag was part of the full divisional issue given to DH Hill's Division (then Rode's at C'Ville) in April, 1863. The last battle honor on those flags is for "Fredericksburg."

WD 367 was taken at Appomattox in 1865 - and was the flag the regiment used at Chancellorsville, it having replaced the well-worn 12 star ANV wool/cotton flag the regiment received in May, 1862. This latter flag survives in the collections of the Columbus Museum in Columbus, GA. Evidently, the 12th Georgia had an honor for "Chancellorsville" painted on their flag sometime after the battle. usually the flags with that honor came from the full divisional issue to AP Hill's Light Division (later Pender's and part of Heth's).

4) Lastly, WD 19, the flag claimed to be that of the 12th Georgia, is an unmarked ANV Third Bunting battle flag which the troops of DH Hill's/Rodes' Division would never have carried since they were part of the full divisional issue of April, 1863.

Thus, with the abvoe evidence presented, this flag may well be one of the three stated flags from Rodes' troops or possibly from Anderson's Division - but it is NOT the flag of the 12th GEorgia Infantry. Many times, such unmarked unit flags were given a number based on a few prisoners taken when that flag is not from their regiment. Case in point - a PA regiment claimed to take the flag of the 19th Georgia, an ANV Second Bunting issue, at Fredericksburg. Two pieces of existing evidence completely disprove this.

1) The existence of another Second Bunting ANV flag for the 19th Georgia that came from one of its officers. Second Bunting flags were limited in their issue and there could not have been two such types for a unit. Second Buntings were always replaced by Third or later bunting issues.

2) A captian of the 14th Tennessee, of the then same brigade as the 19th Georgia (Archer's), wrote a flag requisition that is in his CSR file asking for a replacement flag for the regiment and stated his reason as being to replace the flags lost in Decmber, 1862 at Fredericksburg!

The 14th Tennessee and 19th Georgia were right next to each other in the line of battle when Meade's PA Division broke their line. Both units lost men as prisoner s and they got intermingled. This flag is also unmarked.

So we have to be VERY careful in believing the claims of units that take unmarked CS flags as to their proper ID.

Greg Biggs

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12th Ga never lost a flag
Re: 12th Ga never lost a flag
Re: 12th Ga never lost a flag
Re: 12th Ga never lost a flag - evidence
Re: 12th Ga never lost a flag - evidence
Re: 12th Ga never lost a flag - evidence
Re: 12th Ga never lost a flag - evidence
Re: 12th Ga never lost a flag - evidence
Re: 12th Ga never lost a flag - evidence
Re: 12th Ga never lost a flag - evidence
Re: 12th Ga never lost a flag - evidence
Re: 12th Ga never lost a flag - evidence
Re: 12th Ga never lost a flag
Re: 12th Ga never lost a flag
Re: 12th Ga never lost a flag
Re: 12th Ga never lost a flag